Today, the United States Senate Voted to give retroactive immunity to telecom companies who choose to participate in President Bush’s new warrantless eavesdropping programs.
Leading the charge — West Virginia’s Jay Rockefeller!!!
But how could that be? Well, follow the fucking money:
Wasn’t the point in electing a billionaire carpet bagger that he couldn’t be bought?
Seriously. I encourage everyone to read up on this. Tell your Republican grandparents. West Virginia deserves to know about Rockefeller’s vomit-inducingly abysmal sellout.
Tags: Everyone has a price
February 12, 2008 at 6:17 pm
We can argue repub or dem all day long, but in the end they are all a bunch of self-serving assholes, and if you think any of them give a rats ass about you you’re dillusional. They sell votes to stay in power. Period. And Rockefeller knows he can get caught screwin’ his cat and get re-elected in WV.
February 12, 2008 at 7:21 pm
Where is the new Rockefeller High School and Civic Arena going to go? Seriously, what pork came home from this deal?
He is bullet proof, so I truly doubt that 20K in campaign funds would make him give a shit about something he didn’t believe in.
February 12, 2008 at 7:51 pm
You’re assuming he believes in something.
February 12, 2008 at 8:57 pm
Looks like it is time for me to change my cell provider over to something else… it’s a shame that Verizon isn’t in WV…
February 12, 2008 at 10:27 pm
Not so fast.
Verizon gave him A BUNCH of money too. Too bad their logo doesn’t look so much like the Death Star.
February 13, 2008 at 9:09 am
$20,000? There has to be more to this. Jay wipes his ass on $10,000 bills, so thats like one square of two-ply to him. There must be something else going on behind the scenes… Maybe Charleston’s AT&T call in center is going to get expanded as a result or something?
February 13, 2008 at 10:04 am
Demosthenes.or.locke hit the nail on the head. AT&T Customer Care Center being build in the Wheeling area bringing 200 jobs.
http://www.the-highlands.com/special-update-1.html
February 13, 2008 at 10:54 am
Bingo PHD! Score one for the overeducated idiots.
Jay Rockefeller can’t be bought for ONLY 20 Gs! It takes a little more to buy him!
February 13, 2008 at 10:59 am
There’s that. And also, it was a lot more than $20K.
February 13, 2008 at 11:47 am
It is difficult to argue that John D. Rockefeller IV — who is personally worth hundreds of millions of dollars — and who has spent millions of his own dough to fund his political campaigns —– can be bought by campaign contributions or political support.
Knowing Jay, I would respectfully suggest that, although he is (in his own way unrealistic way) well-meaning (one could debate this point, I agree) — his fatal flaw is that he just plain . . . . . dumb.
February 13, 2008 at 12:25 pm
I think those of you who are arguing that this isn’t that much money are missing the point. Focus on the amount of increase, not on the dollar amount. See that giant spike? Think that’s just a coincidence? Donations shot way up and the telecoms got the result they wanted.
Also, here’s a theory about why even a smallish amount of money might be significant:
That being said, I don’t think the explanation is as simple as just saying that Rockefeller was bought. I think Atrios was probably right on the money (no pun intended) when he wrote this:
To me, the important point is that I don’t see any way in which Rockefeller’s stance on telecom immunity could be said to represent the will of his constituents. How many calls or emails do you think Rockefeller got from constituents telling him that he should support telecom immunity? How many West Virginians are even aware of this issue, let alone how many are in favor of it?
February 13, 2008 at 12:47 pm
If Byrd had accepted this money, would we be having this conversation?
I’m just asking.
I don’t give a damn about Rockefeller, but I do wonder if we give Byrd a free.
February 13, 2008 at 1:10 pm
If Byrd did this, there would be a conversation about “all the good things he has brought to West Virginia.” If Byrd killed a litter of cute puppies and drank their blood, most people in WV would start talking about the highway money or hospitals he has built…
February 13, 2008 at 1:36 pm
Actually, no. I think I’d call him on it.
The thing is, Byrd isn’t doing much of anything these days.
February 13, 2008 at 2:29 pm
You aren’t “most people” then. I don’t think thats a surprise to the readers of this blog.
February 13, 2008 at 2:40 pm
Byrd votes the right way and he gets “If Byrd killed a litter of cute puppies and drank their blood, most people in WV would start talking about the highway money or hospitals he has built…”
What the hell do you want?
February 13, 2008 at 3:07 pm
Jay (who has an unfortunate name for this particular thread) is right–Byrd votes the right way and takes care of his state. I ask you, if he didn’t fund the highways and hospitals, just who would? Blankenship? Capito? The reason Byrd’s name is on everything is that he’s the one who secured said road, hospital, educational building, bridge, park, comfy chair, etc…
And to follow up mountain daddy’s question, before we ask what would people do if Byrd did this, we must ask, ‘Would Byrd do this?’ Yes, he takes money from PACS and industries (28% of his contributions), but just before voting in favor of a bill protecting them from major liability?
February 13, 2008 at 4:31 pm
Yup. Damned if they do, damned if they don’t gets us nowhere.
February 13, 2008 at 4:59 pm
Either way, I’d like to point out that Robert C. Byrd has nothing to do with Rockefeller being a surveillance state loving Bush lapdog.
February 13, 2008 at 5:26 pm
I don’t think a member of Byrd’s staff is married to the chief industry lobbyist in WV. I’m just saying….
February 13, 2008 at 7:14 pm
Jay, you are on the senate Intelligence committee. You see and here stuff that would curl my toes, I am sure. If you think this was a great idea, defend it. Seriously, to me it sounds as if I am leaking freedom from my left front tire.
February 13, 2008 at 8:20 pm
For the record, I’m not the senator or someone trying to be funny (not that I couldn’t be). I wouldn’t want J-Rock to go all Cindy Fritch on me.
aside: I remember when my sister, who was a nurse’s aide, came home all star-struck and proud because she got to carry Jay’s adopted daughter from the birth mother to Sharon after the delivery.
February 14, 2008 at 9:11 am
Dare I Say It,
It is not the Feds job to build your hospitals (unless you are a veteran.) And yes, if you go throughout the mountains, particularly in other states, you will find that schools, hospitals, train tracks, and many, many other facilties were built by the coal companies.
I wasn’t trying to pick a Byrd vs. Rockefeller fight; I could care less about either. I was simply throwing the question out there.
All of us agree about the raping of the land from the coal companies, but let me throw this out there: Imagine if we had no coal companies. What would life in McDowell and Logan be like then? Would your precious governor and his - to borrow a word from HK - “lapdog” Legislature provide for these people any better?
The coal companies have drained tremendous resources from this state. We all agree. But going overseas and luring companies from Japan isn’t going to keep money in W.Va, either (true it may save the environment somewhat better.)
The real issue - the only issue worth debating - is the retention of college graduates in W.Va. Educated young people are the only salvation for this state…and especially for Charleston, which has no crtical mass.
Byrd and Rockefeller are irrelevant at this point.
February 14, 2008 at 9:37 am
Tilting a $4 million campaign with $20k worth of lapdoggery. Clandestine adoptions. Carpetbaggery. Why has nobody mention the Illuminati yet?
February 14, 2008 at 10:10 am
So what’s your explanation, BigStomp? Personally, I think the best explanation is in my comment above — despite his claims to the contrary, Rockefeller simply doesn’t share the same values as his constituents on this issue. Whatever the explanation, the bottom line is the same — this was a terrible move on Jay’s part and all of his explanations are bullshit.
February 14, 2008 at 10:24 am
mountain daddy, the whole country benefits from the extraction of coal from our state and the vast majority would not have the localized consequences of it anywhere near them. For that they get to help pay for our interstates (which I’m sure you avoid using at all costs since it violates your principles), hospitals, drug rehabs, schools, and anything else our delegation can wrest from the national NIMBYs.
Yeah, go down to Buffalo and tell those Toyota employees to snap out of it and stop spilling their seed upon the ground - they’re just fooling themselves with their fancy wages and benefits.
Tell us, mountain daddy, other than geologists and mining engineers, what would these college grads be working at besides developing Mutual Shoe Shine business plans?
February 14, 2008 at 10:44 am
U.S. Senators rarely share the views of their constituencies. Reps. tend to adopt a delegate model where they act as a microcosm of the constituency, whereas Senators tend to adopt a trustee model where they feel entrusted, via elections, to make decision based on their own judgment about what is best for the country. As Senators deal mainly with national issues and Reps with local. I am not saying that what the Rock did was right or wrong, just that US Senators usually don’t act like their constituencies.
February 14, 2008 at 3:26 pm
I have to agree with Raging Red, Jay (who I sometimes like, because sometimes he votes the way I want) doesn’t really share our values. Or maybe he thinks, in that big-government Democrat way, that his job is to protect us from ourselves and everyone else.
How many here recall that, in the mid-80s, Jay sat on the Senate panel investigating obscenity in rock lyrics? That was so funny I watched it twice on C-Span.
February 14, 2008 at 9:09 pm
The best explanation has already been offered here - members of the intelligence committee hear things inside that lead-lined room that nobody else does in the civilian community. Granted, the neo-cons successfully used the former chairman to “shape” some of the information that was distributed to the committee in the run-up to this fucked up war, but even the stuff thats told in there thats real would curl most people’s hair. When you err on that committee, I guess you have to err on the conservative side. He voted wrong on the war. He’s one of the few to admit it was the wrong vote. I’m not saying he voted right or wrong on FISA, just that regardless of how intelligent he is or isnt, or how compelling the case was or wasnt made inside the lead-lined room, he didnt make his decision based on $20k in contributions. Politically he doesnt “need” the telecoms. And with a $4 million war chest and growing, he doesnt “need” the money.
Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
February 14, 2008 at 10:06 pm
First of all, it’s $57,100 for this election cycle and if HK’s snazzy graph is right, it paints a quid pro quo picture. It looks bad.
And why, as many people have pointed out, would they rather shut it down than have the telecoms answer up? Why would the telecoms turn off the taps for non-payment if our security is at risk? Sounds dangerously myopic to me, if it is what they say it is. Hell, even Lucky Luciano didn’t extort the Sicily invasion. What they’re doing does not match what they are saying, and while that’s par for politicians, I think the bar should be a hell of a lot higher when they are trampling the Constitution.
Sometimes a cigar is a Lewinski Cigar and I think that’s what we’re getting.
February 15, 2008 at 9:27 am
There’s nothing that he could have heard that would change the fact that telecom immunity is a bad idea. The FISA law as it existed at the time would have allowed the Bush administration to do what it wanted to do — they just would have had to get a warrant, from a court whose proceedings are secret, and which they could even have done retroactively. And the telecoms’ lawyers knew that and knew that they were also violating privacy/confidentiality laws that they should be quite familiar with.
And the Bush administration was gunning for this shit before 9/11 even happened.
There’s no way around it, Big Stomp, it’s all bullshit. And since there is no legitimate reason for Rockefeller to do what he did, you’ll have to excuse those of us who start speculating about other reasons that he may have done it.
February 15, 2008 at 9:42 am
Well, its merely opinion to say there is no “legitimate” reason to vote up FISA, if you live outside the Intel committee. (Me, Id vote against FISA. But the less you know, the easier that vote is.)
Ive no problem with the speculation going on here at all, RRed - my own views as expressed here are just that. What are politics worth if not a good discussion? For most of us, its a spectator sport. Once in a while we have a chance to vote. Most of us don’t bother. Funny, that.
Lewinsky cigar - thats funny too!
February 16, 2008 at 4:33 am
Jay, being snide to the point of being stupid is useless. The high tech industy follows young bright people…not the other way around. I am not gonna argue with u. If u think the current way is working…then explain our fucking demise. You are bullshitting yourself pal.
February 16, 2008 at 8:51 am
You’re going to have to prove that because I don’t believe it. The main things companies look for when choosing a location is good government, good schools, quality health care, something to do after work, etc… If a high-tech company is free to chose a location they will pick an attractive place to raise a family most likely leaning towards the progressive and except for Morgantown or Fayetteville, we ain’t got it. Hell, it took Byrd forcing them to put the FBI fingerprint center in Clarksburg to get something. I’m sure you howled over that one, too.
We ain’t dead yet, mountain daddy, but our decline comes from our topography, our inbred politics, and having put all our eggs in one black dust crusted basket. Uncle Buck puts in a hardwood flooring factory in Mingo, the employees demand a living wage, he brings in the immigrants. There’s our history in a sentence. That’s the reason for our demise.
So, if you think you can get a group of college graduates to stay here en masse until a company sees the light, then have at it - I’d love to see the plan. But until you can do what others can’t, at least be grateful for the bone we get thrown once in a while.
February 16, 2008 at 2:27 pm
I’m with Jay on this one.
February 18, 2008 at 5:37 pm
Yep - Jay just nailed it.